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Cl vs Stark part 2

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Re: Cl vs Stark part 2

Postby  angelina_jolie » Thu Feb 22, 2018 10:02 am

  21 Feb 2018, 09:07 GMT » luckdragon8 wrote:
it was pointed out to you that changing civ settings midway is less than ideal. your response: it was "bad/outdated" enough to outweigh not confusing the players. i fail to see that.

and "man up" as in: dont make it sound with every single post that you are not in the slightest at fault for this mess by any stretch of the imagination.
its not about making mistakes, but taking responsibility.

"you care about the community" i feel like youre trying to be ironic. why exactly?

 Edited by robo: Smurfing is not appreciated on AoCZone


Please dont start a discussion about these little things... Gman made the best calls possible in the situations! He honoured the rules like a strong admin. Hold your drama or feedback for the next tourney!
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Re: Cl vs Stark part 2

Postby  Carlini8 » Fri Feb 23, 2018 1:18 pm

As I was reading this I presumed I was reading chat about a £1,000,000,000 tournament. I then looked at the top of the screen, saw it was MoA5 with a prize pool of… well had a quick look at the post last year says $839 with 40% going to the winner. Presumably it is more now but with Viper obviously taking first you are looking at a figure that isn’t about the money, it’s about playing the game. People are generally playing this tournament either to play AoE, for the pride of winning, for beating players that are better than you but on a different map or just because they like tournaments.

I am going to completely ignore the first two issues. G1 is literally a non point, as many people have pointed out. I hate being host as you feel like it is you to blame for wrong map, the reality is this is on both players. The standard victory is exactly the same. I guess this is brought up just to flesh out a reasoning for an AW when in reality it is both players responsibility to check.

So this leaves us one final issue of picking Celts when that wasn’t one of the 3 civs that should be picked. There has also been mention that CL didn’t know how many restarts – something to clarify here: Checking something is correct, doesn’t mean you don’t know or didn’t know at one point. Huehuecoyotl22 has mentioned that CL did know there were 2 restarts when they discussed it. I guess everyone in AoCZone has never forgotten anything in their life, congrats guys, I do all the time, currently it is why I started to read this thread.

This small community is split into mainly two groups. Let’s call them AoC Zone and China Zone. The majority of the calls here seem to be to blame the Chinese for not understanding the tournament settings. The Chinese player had settings translated for them that said Celts war for the game and then when trying to clarify this was also told Celt war again.

Note: I have only read this thread about what happened, really don’t care enough to go find more, however if everything in here is true – AW doesn’t seem fair at all. Personally I think this is the fault of the Age of Empires community and not the player. I don’t know about you non Chinese speaking guys, but I have tried to use Chinese websites quite a lot of late, hell I have tried to watch Chinese streams in the past. It is almost impossible without that auto translate button – which unfortunately for me didn’t show up. Let us pretend you are trying to do something on one of these websites and you have a trusted translator (Lanchi) come in and say this button here does exactly what you want it to. This represents picking Celts. Then, just to be sure, when you are about to press the button, you ask a trusted streamer, Paladin (I guess he is the Memb Chinese equiv?), if you should press that button, he says yes. So you press the button because two people you trust in the community have told you to. Then boom, that button is the Admin Loss button, what an idiot, you just lost because you did what two translators said.

If you want to integrate the Chinese into the tournament, this should be a community effort. There are a handful of people that put in a lot of effort just to translate to these guys. As a community we should learn from this and translate all rules and settings on the official tournament post or set up a separate Chinese one that can be linked. A side note for the people complaining about “Oh I want it in my language then”, instead of acting like a 6 year old child who’s 5 year old sibling has just been given a sweet, go and make your community big enough to warrant it. The Chinese community is the biggest in Age of Empires, go watch one of their streams and see. They organised two LANs in the past 2 years for the community and pumped thousands into the international community.



Now, onto the admin bashing. Do you enjoy Age of Empires 2? Are you here on AoCZone because you want to watch or play this game? Maybe you are just in it for the drama, if you are, this may not apply – I will say however, there are better sources of drama out there, go find them.

Admins do not get paid anything. Admins do not gain anything. Real life comes first, if you want a tournament where there is guaranteed to be an admin there for every game, pay them. Put part of the prize pool towards paying for their time. If you don’t like that there wasn’t an admin there, volunteer yourself, do the work yourself. Pissed me off just coming here and seeing people complaining about this, complaining about that, but doing nothing to solve it.

In short I guess my point is, I don’t see it as CLs fault (from what is posted in this thread) and that the community should learn and future tournaments should have rules translated to Chinese on the rules thread or a specific thread so that the community can vet them and there doesn’t need to be private messages between translators and the players. If you are playing a Chinese person, link them to the Chinese rules, bish bash bosh job done. There are already people doing the translating, so just put it somewhere visible to all.
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Re: Cl vs Stark part 2

Postby  Slaiter » Fri Feb 23, 2018 2:16 pm

I guess I couldn't have expressed myself better than Carlini did with his post. This should be mostly about being inclusive not exclusive, I don't understand some of the comments I have read, something along the lines of ''Maybe they should play again in their own plattform again''.

First, as a small community the biggest chance to be seen is grouping everyone under the same plattform / streams / tournaments to push for bigger amount of players / tournament prizes, but secondly I guess most of you heard about a game called League of Legends (aka LoL), well last years (september/october 2017) there was one of the biggest esports events hold, which was worlds2017, and it was hosted in China, viewers amount showed that, the biggest percent of viewers were Chinese players even in matches where the match time suited very well NA/EU (and EU/NA teams playing eachother), it was still a majority of Chinese viewers, that means one of the biggest if not the biggest communities of gamers / esports is Chinese community, I think we should do everything possible not only for top players to keep playing tournaments, but maybe for other Chinese players to move to Voobly from VooblyCN.

Also for the rules/admin topic. People do this mostly at the moment just to help/have tournaments going, so at least appreciate their effort instead of just critizicing for the sake of making drama, maybe some day most of them will get tired of doing anything and not many more tournaments will be there so we can watch them. As for rules translation I suggest maybe gathering volunteer people that would like to translate rules to their own language (ex: Chinese, Spanish, Vietnamese, etc), list them somewhere and whenever there's a new tournament or a rule update, they will be informed in PM's or some other way so they can translate it also, like this we might run into less problems with rules and maybe more people would be willing to join tournaments not being afraid to make some kind of mistakes rule-related.
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Re: Cl vs Stark part 2

Postby  Manu » Fri Feb 23, 2018 3:18 pm

  23 Feb 2018, 12:18 GMT » Carlini8 wrote:
As I was reading this I presumed I was reading chat about a £1,000,000,000 tournament. I then looked at the top of the screen, saw it was MoA5 with a prize pool of… well had a quick look at the post last year says $839 with 40% going to the winner. Presumably it is more now but with Viper obviously taking first you are looking at a figure that isn’t about the money, it’s about playing the game. People are generally playing this tournament either to play AoE, for the pride of winning, for beating players that are better than you but on a different map or just because they like tournaments.

I am going to completely ignore the first two issues. G1 is literally a non point, as many people have pointed out. I hate being host as you feel like it is you to blame for wrong map, the reality is this is on both players. The standard victory is exactly the same. I guess this is brought up just to flesh out a reasoning for an AW when in reality it is both players responsibility to check.

So this leaves us one final issue of picking Celts when that wasn’t one of the 3 civs that should be picked. There has also been mention that CL didn’t know how many restarts – something to clarify here: Checking something is correct, doesn’t mean you don’t know or didn’t know at one point. Huehuecoyotl22 has mentioned that CL did know there were 2 restarts when they discussed it. I guess everyone in AoCZone has never forgotten anything in their life, congrats guys, I do all the time, currently it is why I started to read this thread.

This small community is split into mainly two groups. Let’s call them AoC Zone and China Zone. The majority of the calls here seem to be to blame the Chinese for not understanding the tournament settings. The Chinese player had settings translated for them that said Celts war for the game and then when trying to clarify this was also told Celt war again.

Note: I have only read this thread about what happened, really don’t care enough to go find more, however if everything in here is true – AW doesn’t seem fair at all. Personally I think this is the fault of the Age of Empires community and not the player. I don’t know about you non Chinese speaking guys, but I have tried to use Chinese websites quite a lot of late, hell I have tried to watch Chinese streams in the past. It is almost impossible without that auto translate button – which unfortunately for me didn’t show up. Let us pretend you are trying to do something on one of these websites and you have a trusted translator (Lanchi) come in and say this button here does exactly what you want it to. This represents picking Celts. Then, just to be sure, when you are about to press the button, you ask a trusted streamer, Paladin (I guess he is the Memb Chinese equiv?), if you should press that button, he says yes. So you press the button because two people you trust in the community have told you to. Then boom, that button is the Admin Loss button, what an idiot, you just lost because you did what two translators said.

If you want to integrate the Chinese into the tournament, this should be a community effort. There are a handful of people that put in a lot of effort just to translate to these guys. As a community we should learn from this and translate all rules and settings on the official tournament post or set up a separate Chinese one that can be linked. A side note for the people complaining about “Oh I want it in my language then”, instead of acting like a 6 year old child who’s 5 year old sibling has just been given a sweet, go and make your community big enough to warrant it. The Chinese community is the biggest in Age of Empires, go watch one of their streams and see. They organised two LANs in the past 2 years for the community and pumped thousands into the international community.



Now, onto the admin bashing. Do you enjoy Age of Empires 2? Are you here on AoCZone because you want to watch or play this game? Maybe you are just in it for the drama, if you are, this may not apply – I will say however, there are better sources of drama out there, go find them.

Admins do not get paid anything. Admins do not gain anything. Real life comes first, if you want a tournament where there is guaranteed to be an admin there for every game, pay them. Put part of the prize pool towards paying for their time. If you don’t like that there wasn’t an admin there, volunteer yourself, do the work yourself. Pissed me off just coming here and seeing people complaining about this, complaining about that, but doing nothing to solve it.

In short I guess my point is, I don’t see it as CLs fault (from what is posted in this thread) and that the community should learn and future tournaments should have rules translated to Chinese on the rules thread or a specific thread so that the community can vet them and there doesn’t need to be private messages between translators and the players. If you are playing a Chinese person, link them to the Chinese rules, bish bash bosh job done. There are already people doing the translating, so just put it somewhere visible to all.


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Re: Cl vs Stark part 2

Postby  Agoodperson » Fri Feb 23, 2018 6:19 pm

A lot of Chinese fans and I would like to translate the rules into Chinese if needed.
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Re: Cl vs Stark part 2

Postby  Agoodperson » Fri Feb 23, 2018 6:27 pm

And thanks very much to those who are friendly to Chinese palyers.
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Re: Cl vs Stark part 2

Postby  luckdragon8 » Fri Feb 23, 2018 7:21 pm

  22 Feb 2018, 09:02 GMT » angelina_jolie wrote:
  21 Feb 2018, 09:07 GMT » luckdragon8 wrote:
it was pointed out to you that changing civ settings midway is less than ideal. your response: it was "bad/outdated" enough to outweigh not confusing the players. i fail to see that.

and "man up" as in: dont make it sound with every single post that you are not in the slightest at fault for this mess by any stretch of the imagination.
its not about making mistakes, but taking responsibility.

"you care about the community" i feel like youre trying to be ironic. why exactly?

 Edited by robo: Smurfing is not appreciated on AoCZone


Please dont start a discussion about these little things... Gman made the best calls possible in the situations! He honoured the rules like a strong admin. Hold your drama or feedback for the next tourney!



"Please dont start a discussion about these little things..."
95 comments in, im "starting" a discussion?
secondly: "little" things with great effects, dont u think?


"Gman made the best calls possible in the situations!"
debateable, to say the least.

"He honoured the rules like a strong admin."
i have to disagree.

"Hold your drama or feedback for the next tourney!"
seems pretty random. especially since i already made my points. and its not like hes gonna address any of them anyway.

tc
[23:55]<BuzZ_Bleys> i wanna watch u
[23:56]<BuzZ_Bleys has left the game room>
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Re: Cl vs Stark part 2

Postby  GmanStreams » Fri Feb 23, 2018 7:46 pm

Surprised you didnt bring another smurf 11
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Re: Cl vs Stark part 2

Postby  Sinken » Fri Feb 23, 2018 11:54 pm

  23 Feb 2018, 18:46 GMT » GmanStreams wrote:
Surprised you didnt bring another smurf 11


Not really a valid point to critizism, fair or unfair
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Re: Cl vs Stark part 2

Postby  buddy__1 » Sat Feb 24, 2018 10:47 am

It's easy to get tunnel vision and only see the problems sometimes, which I feel I did as well, and have to say I agree with Carlini's post completely.

If you think about it, the admins, players, casters and viewers and so on, is what makes up the community as a whole. And the success of it all relies on ourselves (while some more than others) to make it into something cool, and something we want to be a part of.

So its really on us to try to steer the ship in the right direction, and you already see people offering to help where they can.
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